Scratch Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive 55

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Community Portal Archives

Please start with Interwiki

 Done

I just want to remember you of our wish, to start with Interwiki between this english Scratch-Wiki and our german language DACH-Scratch-Wiki, see here and here: We started in 02/2012 and - if you can see here - the DACH-Scratch-Wiki already contains >380 qualified german articles, that are mostly connected to the coresponding english articles, but sadly only in one direction, from German to English and not backwards (Until now we use the so called "Servicekasten" at the end of most german artikles for both: To Link to the cresponing english artikle and for annautomated generated string to copy&paste a link to this artikle in the forum in correct BBCode. Who could help to estblish real Interwiki? -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 15:12, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

I can do reasonable French translations, but sorry, no German. If you ever make it to French, give me a message. :)
Hardmath123 (talk | contribs) 16:24, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

I don't speak german, but you could go to the german language forum on the Scratch Forums
Coinman (talk | contribs) 16:28, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

No - I did not ask for help with the german wiki - we have the german scratch community to build and enlarge it. I was asking for help to establish a method for linking the english and the german wiki by Interwiki like it is established standard in Wikipedia. This could only be done by the admins... -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 20:56, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

Will this thread end like the last time, when the german speaking Scratch community asked for Interwiki here some months ago? Some of you sayed "that would be very good" but no responsible person answered and after some waiting the suggestion was achived without any substantiable reaktion...That's not realy motivating for the german speaking scratch community...Does anybody know what to do? -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 07:46, 9 September 2012 (UTC)

We're actually waiting for the bureaucrats to discuss this and come up with a response, I believe. Apologies for the wait.
Veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 15:50, 9 September 2012 (UTC)

I really like the idea and I want to make something happen, but I can't without JSO's approval, and he hasn't really responded to many of my messages lately - so blame him.
Lucario621 (talk | contribs) 20:36, 9 September 2012 (UTC)

I found a user who seems to know German. S/he used German in this project.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:47, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

We have many members of the German Scratch Community that know German, including me ;-) I know Wilena, she is from Austria (yes, they speak German there too...even in Switzerland they do...therfore our Wiki is called DACH-Scratch-Wiki ;-). Wilena is registered as one of the authors of our http://wiki.scratch-dach.info/, but she didn't write much until now...

Thanks for unarchiving this thread! Yes it's not done...not until Interwiki is established or rejected....-
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 16:59, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

Thank Scimonster. He recovered this. What took so long for the answer?
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 20:11, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

As Lucario said, we need to talk to JSO about this and then things can happen. I believe Luc's told me that JSO's busy as well. I don't have contact info for JSO, so basically the most that I (or anyone else really) can do is to bother Luc until he bothers JSO into saying something.

(note: don't bother Luc; leave it to me)
Veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 23:45, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

I think you can bother JSO at wiki at scratch dot mit dot edu. But leave that to me. :D
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 10:00, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Can we do this manually? There seems to be nothing happening. I may not know German, but I know how to use Google Translate. I'll start linking some pages soon if nothing happens.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:15, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

We could do it, but we don't know how we should do it, in an organised fashion. Please don't work on this without instruction, or we'll have a bit of a mess.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 21:30, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

Most articles have an External Link thing. It can be put there.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 00:23, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

Please don't. It's better to do it in an organized fashion, as veggie said. The built-in software will also work better.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:09, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

In our Dach-Scartch-Wiki we already have a link in many german article to the coresponding english article. This is true for alle articles in this DACH-Scratch-Wiki-Category:En-Link. Even if you don't understand german, you'll find the link to your english Scratch-Wiki in the so called "Service-Kasten" at the end of each german article. So, because the links in one direction already existy, it would be very easy to switch to a professional use of Interwiki as soon as the technical solution for Interwiki works in both Wikis. By the way: Is somebody of you visting Scratch Connecting Worlds 2013 in Barcelona (homepage)? I'm planing to be there and to speak about the german Scratch-Grassroots-Movement and how the german Scratch-Wiki helps it. It would be great, to have Interwiki until then, to give communities of other languages a good example how they could start their own native Scratch-Wiki. -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 11:35, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

I took a look at the German artikles and didn't notice anything that led to an English page except for on the homepage where it said "english speaker? See: Scratch Wiki:About" and led to a page in German, which I think should be in English if it's linked to for English speakers, or have a duplicate page or a link to this wiki. I think Lucario621 and JSO may be waiting to see how the German wiki is formatted and the German wiki is waiting for us to do something and nothing is happening since nobody knows what to do. I saw the link to the "official" way of doing this, but I didn't understand it that well. I agree with MartinWollenweber that we should have the Interwiki ready for the 2013 Scratch Connecting Worlds conference in Barcelona.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:20, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

a) "except for on the homepage where it said "english speaker?" See: http://scratch-dach.info/index.php?title=Scratch-Wiki:About ... Funny - for me it seems to be english ;-)

b) every single german article listet here: http://scratch-dach.info/index.php?title=Kategorie:En-Link has a link to the english Scartch-Wiki (mostely in the box at the end, sometimes, in category-pages at the top)

c) the Interwiki ready for the 2013 Scratch Connecting Worlds conference in Barcelona: Yes!!! ;-)
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 23:31, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

a)Strange, earlier I viewed it and Google Translate picked it up as German and I looked and saw many strange characters that were German.

b)The German Community is organizing pretty well, although I had to go through three subcategories to get to an article on Blocks. I like where the link was put, and I could read parts of it such as US-Scratch-Wiki and then the link was in English, but maybe to make things easier the stuff explaining the link should be in both languages. Perhaps some sort of Interwiki template could be used for this purpose and would have something like To see this page in English, see Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive 55 http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/Scratch Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive 55 which in code is ''To see this page in English, see [http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/{{{1|{{FULLPAGENAME}}}}} {{{2|http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/{{{1|{{FULLPAGENAME}}}}}}}}]''

c)We need to do something or figure something out, otherwise it won't be done in time.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:39, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

I made a mock up of the template. Currently it is in the italic style where it's just words in italics and links. I'm not sure if we would like to make it into a box template, but feel free (admins) to edit my sandbox as testing ground for the template if you decide to use it. User:Curiouscrab/Sandbox
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:59, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't such template have to be in German, though? :P
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 06:20, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

I made a German version of it, but I had it in English so that English speaking Scratchers who see it could read it if that were on the Scratch-DACH-Wiki. It would be in German if it was here.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:56, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Please start with Interwiki: At Scratch Connecting Worlds 2013 in Barcelona

What has to be done, to solve Interwiki professionally, can only be done by the wiki-admins and is explained in Manual Pages for Interwiki. For a Wiki-professional it should only last a few hours to set it up technically (I am an admin of DACH-Scratch-Wiki, but we have no "wiki-professionals"...we have to learn it all ourself ;-). The second step would be the linking, that can be done by all wiki-authors: With an interwiki-bot the linking has only to be done at one side, at the other side the bot does back-linking automatically. At Scratch Connecting Worlds 2013 in Barcelona I hope to meet the Scratch-Wiki-Admins and to convince other language communities (e.g. Spanish an French) to build up native Scratch-Wikis, that could all be linked by Interwiki, like it in Wikipedia. By the way: It could be, that Scratch and BYOB are actually represented much better in the german wikipedia, than in the english one. Who of you want's to change that? (see: Article that lists all Scratch-Links in the german Wikipedia)
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 07:04, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Maybe to help with confusion, we could do what Wikipedia does. All homepages would have links (link display in native language where it links to) to other Scratch Wikis in different languages. Then, we wouldn't have to worry about Interwiki as much. How does that sound?
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:56, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia has Interwiki in the sidebar.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 00:34, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

They have this. It's a list of all the wikipedias in each language. I think we were making this Interwiki stuff way too complicated then it actually is.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:54, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

They do indeed have such a list, but they also have links on the sidebar like this, which are much more helpful in actually finding things, especially when pages on the different wikis have titles that aren't direct translations from one another.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 02:30, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Still, it shouldn't be this complicated. We seem to have ideas as to how to do it, but we just aren't doing anything. As veggie just said, there's a sidebar. Maybe we should have that.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 03:35, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

That is the Interwiki this entire discussion is referring to.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 05:32, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

:-) yes...just read: Scratch Wiki:Interwiki carefully
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 14:32, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ I see. I thought it was adding a link to projects from there to that same page in other languages. Although, I still don't understand why it's so complicated. Just add a toolbar with links, or is the meeting at Barcelona where we find other Scratch Wikis in different languages and add them to the list that will be in the sidebar. Or are we doing both?
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 22:21, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

A plugin needs to be added to allow this, and only JSO (or Lightnin) can add plugins. I don't know anything about the meeting in Barcelona, but I believe Martin is trying to find people in communities in languages like French and Spanish and encourage/help them to start their own wikis. Apparently JSO is helping to organise it, so I'd guess he would be there.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 00:43, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I understand why he is going. I like that idea. I haven't seen JSO on in a while. Maybe Lightnin will be our only hope.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 03:29, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your support. I also hope to meet JSO and if there are other Scratch-Wiki-Authors in Barcelona, I hope to get in discussion with them all.

Could you please do me another favor and have a look at my english proposal. As my native language is not english but german, it's not easy for me to find always the right words. Here is the link to my Proposal text. Please have a look and don't hesitate to change everything you think is wrong direct there in my text, by perserving the meaning that I hopefully was able to express ;-)

• http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/User:MartinWollenweber/ProposalForBarcelona_please_correct_my_not_native_english

P.S. I also contacted JSO at his user-page.
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs)

No problem. There's just one thing, what if let's say French Scratchers are only 5-6 years old. It will be complicated to form a wiki off of that. Not all Scratchers know how to make a wiki. Maybe at Barcelona, you could also propose another wiki just in case Mediawiki's wikis are too complicated or unable to be created/hosted. The first Scratch Wiki was made using Wikia and maybe French Scratchers could make a wiki there to start off and call it Scratch-Français-Wiki and Italian Scratchers could have Scratch-Italiano-Wiki.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 14:56, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Just so you know, I created the DACH-Scratch Wiki article. You can update it with big events happening. Currently it lists the big event as Interwiki being enabled.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 20:04, 2 March 2013 (UTC)

Thank You very much. Great! Some helping links:

• http://wiki.scratch-dach.info/index.php?title=Scratch-Wiki:About
• http://scratched.media.mit.edu/resources/dach-scratch-wiki
• http://wiki.scratch-dach.info/index.php?title=Scratch_Connecting_Worlds_2013_in_Barcelona

1. 1. 1. Look careful : One part of this german article is in english!
      2. Wouldn't it be good, to have an Barcelona Conference article here to?

• http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/Scratch_Wiki#Scratch_Wikis_in_other_languages
  MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 17:11, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, but I had to disable that third link in the list. It's not clean apparently and caused my computer to almost crash 2 times.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 23:42, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't you mind to find out if that's perhaps a local problem at your computer/browser e.g. by asking other, if they ever had the same problem? I have no problems with that page and posted it to many other people and nobody did complain. It would be very important for our Wiki, to find out if there is any general problem. Can you test more and give more information about your configuration/browser? Thanks in advance! -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 15:50, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

I created the French Scratch Wiki here if you want to send anyone over there. I decided since this Scratch Wiki originated from Wikia, why not do the same with other Scratch Wikis.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 23:52, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Now Spanish here.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 23:59, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Great! Hope you find Scratcher that start Scratch-Wikis in French an Spanish language. We found out that most important thing is not the "founding" but the "running" of Wikis: You need lots of people, because mostly only 5% of 100% registered users do the main part of the work. ;-) -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 15:56, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure, but wouldn't it be a better idea to open threads about making spanish/ french wiki in the french/ spanish forums rather that just creating a wiki? Shouldn't the french wiki be created by french Scratchers? I noticed that Google Translates often translates wrong... :|? -
LiFaytheGoblin (talk | contribs) 17:41, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Plus, it's on WikiA, a horrible offsite wiki hosting site that I've heard gives people viruses.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 12:54, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

I've just sent an email to Lightnin. He might be willing to install Interwiki at some point soon.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 15:17, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Thanks! See also here and specially here.
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 14:40, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Marked as done.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:32, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

2.0 style Main Page

 Done

The current Main Page has a rather 1.4 feel, what with the header bars. For 2.0, we should have a more 2.0 feel. I have two styles. One is basically the current page restyled, here. The other is based a bit more in the 2.0 front page, which you can see here. I have two featured images there (but we could revert to only one), and the contents looks more like Scratch News. Which do people think we should use?
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 19:34, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I like the second one. It makes things more visible.
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 19:38, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I do like your idea, but I thought it could "stand out" some more by adding more color to it. I made the outside space of the MP sections 2.0-ish blue and added text shadow up top to see if it would be necessary. Also, the red "Scratchers" represents Scratchers on the wiki finishing edits and the green "Scratchers" represents other Scratchers coming to see the edits. What do you think?
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 21:04, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I prefer the one in your fourth sandbox.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 23:27, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I definitely like the second more; it's a nice, more modern look.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 23:43, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

@Lego: Well, i had it be gray because that's the style used on the site. The colored "Scratchers" looks nice, but i'm a bit hesitant about the shadow.

@CC: Why? The more classic look?

@veggie: :D
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 12:28, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

New style, based on sandbox5. User:Scimonster/Sandbox6. I used Lego's idea of green and red "Scratchers", but that's not the important change. I moved the FA to occupy the entire width (and not have a set height), and put a section explaining a bit about the wiki (with a link to sister projects [namely the German wiki]). How does it look?
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 12:54, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I like that idea. I like the layout of the page (I wanted to say more than just "I like that idea").
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 16:10, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Thanks.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 17:26, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I like the styling on these! Six is good, but the FA is too wide, and the page looks a bit too busy. Can we cut down the amount of "stuff" on the homepage generally? I think the Scratch Wiki section should be more prominent. And I'm not sure about the coloured "scratchers". The red in particular is a bit distracting.
Blob8108 (talk | contribs) 19:41, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I really like the second one better. The first one is kind of boring and has the same long page feel it does currently. I specificly like the second one because there are two columns, which we were not using before.
Joletole (talk | contribs) 21:06, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

All of these seem nice to me - I prefer #6 most of all. But I think once we come to general consensus about style, it's fine to just go for it and put something out there. We can always tweak it later.
Lightnin (talk | contribs) 13:17, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

I like your designs scimonster, and I definitely want to update the main page as soon as possible to keep up with the page of Scratch 2.0. The only problem is that they seem to have some problems with the test 2.0 skin. I'm not sure if this is due to your CSS or the actual wiki skin, but it might be worth waiting for JSO to fix the skin first before continuing... what do you think?
Lucario621 (talk | contribs) 22:34, 21 May 2013 (UTC)

I fixed sandbox5 and 6. I think it's a problem with the CSS specification. :P

It seems like the majority wants the one in sandbox6, so i think that's what we'll do.

PS: When will you learn? I prefer Scimonster, with a capital S (like how it shows up here!)
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:20, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Eh, I'll learn some day scimonster lol.
Lucario621 (talk | contribs) 04:11, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

I thought it was supposed to be sC1m0n5tRr.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 09:03, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

It seems like most people like what is in sandbox6 (including me). I think that an admin should go ahead and update the front page style.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 16:39, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Yup. Since no-one opposed, i did it. Glad to have this finally done!
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 16:59, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

2.0 style templates

 Done

(Yes, i know i'm making lots of 2.0-style topics. It's easier to address each separately.) We have basically two options for templates such as {{stub}}. Use Luc's style (nice and roundish), or use the style currently in {{Unreleased}} (no round bottoms, like on 2.0)? I think the second style (perhaps even white, not gray) is more authentic, because what these templates remind me most of in 2.0 is at the bottom of a forum list, where you can choose standard/mobile, and credits DjangoBB. For sidebar templates, Luc's style is just fine. The only real question is for ones with no header. I say no round bottom. And as for color, for most, use white, but for currently red ones ({{NotUseful}}), use gray.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 13:16, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I kind of like Lucario's 2.0 template style. It looks smaller and just more normal. Though I think {{unreleased}} can stay as it is. For the color style, I think just having every template like {{stub}} and {{notUseful}} the same grey/white makes those templates seem like "just other templates". I think we should have a unique color style for the templates depending on what we use them for (Like notUseful is red and Stub is blue). I think we could have the currently blue templates have that grey/white you talked about. Templates like notUseful could have some red border around them like what I did in my sandbox here.
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 18:16, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

And {{BYOBimgs}} could have a yellow border like the normal template as well as {{BrokenImage}} having orange-ish border. It could still have that grey/white you were talking about but I just decided to mention it.
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 18:36, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

The don't think we need borders for most, though admittedly it might be good on the red templates, The ones you most recently mentioned have no need for other colors. But as a mentioned, the flat bottom is most authentic, and does look nice for the templates that go on top.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 18:54, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I vote the second style; it looks cleaner. And I imagine it'll match the wiki theme once it's updated for to match 2.0. The coloured backgrounds are kinda distracting. I think use the second style with the grey background for all of them, and let the different icons provide the colour.
Blob8108 (talk | contribs) 19:37, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

I tried previewing the images handling the color in my sandbox, and I think it would look best if the border (space outside of template) was a certain color. Also, the reason I like the first style is that it makes the templates look more organizable. We all have opinions...
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 11:29, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

I made the radius smaller for {{notUseful}} in my sandbox, top and bottom, but then, I decided I could give the templates a flat bottom, but smaller radius than {{unreleased}} so it still looks organizable.
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 18:35, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Done. I switched all of the header templates to use a meta template ({{Header Template}}), which has a flat bottom. But, if by consensus we want to change it, it's much easier. {{notUseful}} and similar ones has the same red styling.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 15:00, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

White text on BC templates

On the Block Category templates, the text on the the templates is always a darkish blue. So even if the heading color was a darkish blue like {{Motor Blocks}}, you could hardly see the text. I thought of idea for an option on {{navbox}} or {{collapse top}} to make the text blue or white. That way, the text would come up easier. What do you think of my idea?
Legobob23o (talk | contribs) 23:38, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

Nope, because the it can only be made white inside of the link. So, technically impossible. Sorry.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 09:40, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

We could use a class and put it in Common.css or whatever
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 14:02, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Well, that does sound like it would work.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 14:14, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

2.0 style "new message" thing

I saw a 2.0 styling of the "new message" thing in User:Lucario621/Sandbox9 and I thought of putting some improvements on it in User:Legobob23o/Sandbox2. What do you think of the ideas so far?
~Legobob23o (talk | contribs | sandbox) 23:31, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

It looks kinda upsidedown, and with a strange border color. Perhaps we don't even need that though. If JSO can make a good enough skin, perhaps he can include that in the header. :D
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 06:41, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

The reason I have it "upside down" is because it looks as if a message is coming from the top of a screen saying "you have received a new message" like on mobile devices such as iPhone. But if you really prefer having it like all the other 2.0 style templates, I won't mind.
~Legobob23o (talk | contribs | sandbox) 09:34, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

 Not done

We have several topic that aren't done yet. Is it possible for us to resolve them?

• Please start with Interwiki  Done
• Scratch modification pages
• How To pages?
• 2.0 style Main Page  Done
• 2.0 style templates
• Category changes

Can we get back to some discussions?
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 12:35, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

We can't do too much with Interwiki right now and I thought we already finished the front page 2.0 styling with your sandbox5.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 17:44, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Could you archive the ones that are done, just to clear things up a bit?
Blob8108 (talk | contribs) 17:57, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

@CC: I thought we agreed on the one in sandbox6.

@blob: Good idea.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 19:29, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

@Sci Woops, I didn't refer back to the post when saying that.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:01, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Bump!
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 19:30, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

ST Redirects

Should we create redirects that are ST members names? Sometimes users may want to look up Lightnin and I think it could redirect to Scratch Team.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 16:08, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Not right now. However, i was thinking about a different idea similar to this... I'll post it soon.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 19:01, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Articles about Scratch Modifications on the Scratch Wiki

It seems that there are many articles about insignificant Scratch Modifications on the Scratch Wiki. I think we should make it a rule that Scratch Modifications must be released before they can have an article.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 02:57, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

veggie was going to write up some rules over the summer.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 12:01, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Yep, I'll probably be starting on my style guide probably when I'm up in Canada, this coming weekend. Once I'm done, I'll show it to Luc and then Sci for feedback and then I'll post it publicly (for more feedback).
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 16:21, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Using {{How To}} on tutorials.

I commented here, but Scimonster said I should bring up this on the CP. I noticed that the {{How To}} template is used on some, but not all tutorials. Should it be added to all tutorials?
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 13:46, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

That sounds good to me. If a page follows the How To page guidelines, it can be a how to page. Maybe, in the case of tutorials, it would be helpful to redirect from pages that follow the How To naming conventions-- so "How to Find the Mean of Numbers" could redirect to "Finding the Mean of Numbers" to avoid confusion. But I don't know-- how does that sound?
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 18:57, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Sounds OK. The problem is that then we have duplication. Perhaps what we should do is get rid of Category:How To Pages, and manually categorize them all under their specific tutorial categories.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 18:29, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Hmm... I don't know, I think it's important to keep Category:How To Pages, especially since not all How To pages would be easily categorized as tutorial pages.
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 15:24, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

How to pages tend to simply tell one how to do something, whereas tutorials tend to do the same plus explain why you do something and goes through great detail in doing so.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 15:55, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

How tos and TutorialGirl

I just found this user with a ton of how to guides. Think we should link to them or make how tos on them? Link to her page.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 20:43, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

If any of them are useful, we can make How-Tos.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 13:04, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Could the Scratch Wiki help to promote Scratch Connecting Worlds 2013?

The Scratch Connecting Worlds 2013 will be the first European Scratch conference. It will take place in Barcelona, Spain from July 25-27, 2013. The DACH-Scratch Wiki helps to promote it, by putting an entry at it's frontpage and presentening the conference-program in detail. Also some of our authors will visit the conference, to promote Scratch-Wikis in other native languages. Could the english Scratch-Wiki help by putting the Template:S13bcnNavigation at the frontpage until end of July 2013? Feel free to improve the template!

MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 16:48, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

Hmm, perhaps. But we need some other admins' input as well before doing anything.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 18:31, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

I'm not sure... we don't usually promote events so heavily. I mean, we generally have something on the news but we don't even have a banner for Scratch Day... though this is more wiki-related... IDK. Lucario?
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 07:56, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

@veggieman001: "...this is more wiki-related...": I also think so.: Do you know how long it takes until we get a final decision? The conference already takes place in a few days...the longer we wait, the less it helps... -
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 11:37, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Hello? There are stil 21 days until the Scratch Connecting Worlds starts...there will be >100 sessions including Mitch Resnik, Karen Brennan, Brian Harvey, Jens Mönig and many other well known Scratchers ... The DACH-Scratch-Wiki want's to promote Scratch-Wikis in other native languages. We also hope to solve the Interwiki-Matter after waiting >1,5 years fo a decision...

Is there a reason to wait puting the Conference Information at the Mainpage of the Scratch-Wiki like we did at http://scratch-dach.info ? At least in the Main Page/News, better as an full-linked entry like in Template:S13bcnNavigation.

There are some english speaking countries in Europe, too. ;-)
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 13:34, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

We don't really use the Wiki to promote events like that, but it's great that you're advertising it on the German Wiki. Speaking of that, we are currently looking into the Interwiki. Thanks for your hard work and patience.
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 21:43, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

OK, I understand. I saw that you now mention sister projects like the DACH-Scratch-Wiki at the Homepage: That's even better, because it helps our target to have more Scratch-Wikis in native languages more permanentely than a few days of promotion for Scratch2013BCN. And we're looking forward to Interwiki :-)
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 17:41, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

Registration is back up!

The registration system is back up, using the system that I have created. Since this is fairly relevant to the Scratch Wiki, it should go in the news.
jvvg (talk | contribs) 20:50, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Woot! Bug: Admins need the privilege too.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 09:57, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

It's not a bug. The extension just only gives bureaucrats the privilege by default. I have informed Lightnin about this, and we are currently discussing if anybody else (i.e. non-admins) can have this privilege too. Once that is decided, all of the necessary privileges will be assigned.
jvvg (talk | contribs) 13:36, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Can't wait to have some new users up in here! I need some more company :3
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 14:28, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Who should be able to confirm accounts?

As jvvg announced, the account registration system is up. Yay! (and thanks to jvvg for the hard work!) At the moment, the only people who can confirm accounts are bureaucrats. Any ideas about who else (if anyone) should have that privilege? Should admins be able to confirm accounts? Should we maybe make a special group for people who can confirm accounts (like "experienced wikians")?
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 14:54, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes admins should be able to confirm accounts. The bureaucrats are not very active that i can see, and besides, admins used to be able to. And, people who are trusted enough to approve accounts should also be trusted enough with the rest of the admin tools.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 16:13, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

As I understand it, some of the admin tools allow for really drastic changes - like to the CSS / etc, and other actions on accounts. So I'm not sure it follows that people who can allow accounts to register should also have full admin powers. I think a better approach would be to create a role like "Experienced wikian" who can confirm accounts (and maybe a few other privs, if people think it would be helpful). Most people should never need admin level powers, if things are designed reasonably well.
Lightnin (talk | contribs) 16:34, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

So perhaps "experienced wikians" can have the following rights: confirmaccount, createaccount, protect, delete, bigdelete, autoconfirmed, autopatrol, patrol, movefile, move, move-subpages, suppressredirect, reupload-shared (whatever that means), reupload, rollback, browsearchive, undelete, upload, uploadlocal, unwatchedpages, deletedhistory, deletedtext. That's most of the admin rights, without the really big ones, like editing MediaWiki pages and importing.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 17:23, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Well, ok, but that still doesn't answer the question - why are all those rights necessary for so many people to have?
Lightnin (talk | contribs) 17:33, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Whoever said "so many"? I think a few faithful editors (such as Mathfreak231) could get these, but we don't need a ton of people.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 17:45, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

To better and more directly answer the question, more people would perhaps need those tools so they can assist with the administration of the wiki. The most important rights I see there that I definitely agree experienced editors should have are moving files, deletion, rollback, and access to patrolling. We only have at best two active administrators and there are definitely other editors that can be trusted with some of the admin tools and will able to use them effectively.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 19:23, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

I will admit that I am probably the most active editor to date (because once I checked on the list of active users and it said I had 600+ edits in the last 30 days O.o) and having access to more editing permissions might make my job more interesting. Plus, I'd love to help confirm accounts... :D
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 15:46, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Although I'm not as much a contributor as everyone else in this duiscussion, I think I should have access to the confirm account tool because I did kind of program a bunch of it.
jvvg (talk | contribs) 21:04, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Sounds fair. :)
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:07, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

I see - that makes sense. Thanks for explaining, veggieman001. Seems like all the folks on this thread so far are pretty experienced and long time contributors. We'll need some good criteria for deciding who to promote to this position in the future - so it's worth thinking about that now. Anyway - shall we go with the name: "Experienced Wikians"? Anyone have one that's better? (Something like "Elder knowledgable helpful person" seems best to me, but that doesn't exactly roll off the tongue, know what I mean?
Lightnin (talk | contribs) 15:01, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

Where, though, would a person be able to see who is and isn't an experienced wikian? Will it be by everyone's name? Like in your signature? You would have to have a visible way to tell, like on the old forums when it said by your icon "New Scratcher", "Community Moderator", etc. as of now it's just our username and doesn't say "Wikian".
turkey3 (talk | contribs) 18:40 p.m. July 5, 2013

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘There would be a page that lists active E.W.'s. It doesn't say "sysop" or "admin" in sci/veggie's wiki sigs, does it?
As for the name, I was thinking somewhere along the lines of "junior sysop".
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 00:51, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

Or maybe call the E.W.'s sysops, and rename the current sysops to "senior sysops", because there are only a couple of privileges that they have and EW's don't. I'm still just fine with "Experienced Wikians", because my ideas sound kinda dorky once I think about it.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 15:25, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

I just created the group "Experienced_Wikians" (group names can't have spaces, apparently) and added veggieman001, scimonster, jvvg, and Mathfreak231 in it for now. Like Lightnin mentioned, we'll need to figure out some criteria for decided who can have this position-- any suggestions?
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 17:21, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Looks like you didn't actually add me :P

I feel like it should somewhat be on a case-by-case basis as there are more people we can trust. We definitely can't quantify it with a certain amount of edits, pages, or files needed, so I'm not sure how else we could do that besides a case-by-case.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 17:27, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

I agree with you veggieman001, though I feel as if a bit more should be added on. Kind of like with New Scratchers, where you need at least a minimum of x posts, y projects, and have been on for z days. Besides, this raises a new question. Who can elect Experienced Wikians? Other Experienced Wikians & the bureaucrats, or just the bureaucrats?
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 17:39, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Well, bureaucrats are the only people who can promote/demote people (and it should stay that way). However, I think that perhaps any Experienced Wikian and/or administrator should be able to suggest someone for promotion. Thoughts, everyone?
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 18:47, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, any EW could suggest someone else. I suppose someone else could, too.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 18:52, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Well, it'd be a bit hard to prevent someone else from suggesting because there isn't a "comment deleter" that deletes suggested people not suggested by a EW. So about any wikian could go to a bureaucrats user page and suggest another user. Either way, I like the idea of only EW being able to suggest people because they'll be the most experienced with the website and can most accurately (aside from the bureaucrats) figure out who would be a nice EW.
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 19:25, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

I've wanted to delete pages before (when renaming pages), does that count? :P
Blob8108 (talk | contribs) 17:47, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Oops, veggieman001, I added you now.
Scmb1 (talk | contribs) 20:11, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I kinda think we should be able to edit fully protected pages.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 21:47, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

I think the criteria for somebody being promoted to experienced wikian should be something like this:

• Has been on the wiki for at least 6 months (or another set amount of time)
• Has at least 500 edits (or another set number of edits)
• Understands how to use MediaWiki and uses proper formatting, organization. (e.g. uses headings, templates, and images correctly; and categorizes pages and images)
• Uses proper grammar
• Has never vandalized the wiki or naughty language
• Is trusted by admins and experienced wikians
• Requests to become a experienced wikian

BTW, I am interested in being an experienced wikian.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 21:56, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

I don't like that last one. I think the sysops and EWs should see if you're eligible and ask you if you're interested. It doesn't seem very good to be asking to be "upgraded," although I know someone who did that and was elected as admin.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 22:22, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

+1 to CC. Read my above post.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 22:24, 8 July 2013 (UTC)

Ok, I guess that makes sense. I was thinking that the editor should have a need for the tools, in which case they would request for them.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 00:52, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

I'll bring up again that it would be nice if we could protect pages, or at least edit protected pages. Just putting it out there. :P
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 00:28, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

I might seem crazy, but how about everybody who posted on this topic? Everybody here who doesn't have privileges yet is mature and trustful enough to have such powers. I would also include Hardmath123 as well since he helps out a lot, too.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:39, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Can I make a page about helpful, custom blocks I have created?

 Done

Well, can I?
Hexagon400 (talk | contribs) 07:21, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

How about you build the page in your sandbox first, then we'll decide? We're still a bit unsure about that stuff.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:47, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

Ok... http://wiki.scratch.mit.edu/wiki/User:Hexagon400/Sandbox/UsefulCustomBlocks
Hexagon400 (talk | contribs) 13:28, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

Make Separate Page on Toolbar?

I was wondering if we should make a separate page on the top toolbar in the Scratch Program. It is part of the Scratch User Interface article, although it still isn't updated to Scratch 2.0 yet. Do you think it needs a separate page, because with the shift-clicking and stuff there are many features with the top toolbar alone? I'm willing to create it.
Turkey3 (talk | contribs) 9:22 a.m. July 9, 2013

If, after it was rewritten to 2.0, it has article-length, it can be expanded.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 13:58, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

Are we allowed to register our alts to the wiki?

Or is it just the Scratch Team?
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 12:37, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

It would be preferable if you didn't.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 14:14, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Why? What purpose would you need them for?
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 18:45, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

It might be a recent account request, someone wanting to use their new account on the wiki.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 19:45, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

New Account System could use Templates

I was thinking when you make a user their userpage a template could be added like {{userpage}} that would tell that user that that was their userpage that they could edit as they wish and explain it's initial purpose.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 22:15, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Interesting idea.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 13:58, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Suggestion to set Scratch Wiki logo to protected

Currently, the Scratch Wiki logo is not protected, that is, admin edit and upload only. A normal person can just upload a Scratch Wiki logo he made himself.
Selebon (talk | contribs)

Although it's not protected, it doesn't look like this is a problem. When I logged out and went to the page, I wasn't given the option to upload a new logo. Yes, I could edit it ("using an external application"), but really, there are very few trolls on Scratch, and about none would know about the wiki. So, I don't think it really needs to be protected.

By the way, could someone quickly give me quick summary of what's different about protected pages?
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 23:42, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

I'll do it on your talk page.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 00:13, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

The Wiki Logo should be protected. If you look under the file history you can see "Upload a new version of this file," anyone can updload any image and I will be seen from every page. The file should definitely be protected.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 02:31, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

 Done
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 05:09, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Special:UserLogin

 Done

The sentence saying stuff about not having an account sign up here is duplicated. Somebody probably needs to remove Mediawiki:Requestaccount-loginnotice by blanking it.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 01:16, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Good catch. It is better to make people read S:CONTRIB first, so they know what to do.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 07:10, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Should I Make a Forum Announcement on Joining the Wiki?

I was thinking about it, but then I feel like everyone will register. So Are there any particular rules, like must be a Scratcher? We could use some new faces around here. Maybe it can be stickied for a while? Are there any rules I should post?

Oh, and a quick question, how do you insert the time not manually?
Turkey3 (talk | contribs) 9:17 a.m. July 11, 2013

Perhaps it would be better for a wiki admin or bureaucrat to make that announcement...

To create your signature, type ~~~~ — that makes the scratchsig and time.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 13:28, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

How do you create a template?

Can you tell me?
Hexagon400 (talk | contribs) 18:28, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Just create a page with Template: before its name, like Template:Scratch Versions, and categorise it under Category:Templates or an appropriate subcategory. However, it is best to ask and get input as to whether it's needed before making a template.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 19:54, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

eh... ok.... what about a 'Deprecated' or a 'Not In 2.0'? Template:Deprecated Template:Not In 2.0 neither work
Hexagon400 (talk | contribs) 07:10, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

I believe you may be looking for {{Obsolete feature}}. ;)
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 07:21, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Are users allowed to blank their talk page?

To rephrase the question, can users remove a discussion from their talk page permanently given that the discussion was finished?
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 22:02, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 00:01, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

User's have full control of their own user pages. The discussion can always be retrieved from the revision history.
Bsteward (talk | contribs) 03:00, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Mmkay.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 12:24, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Collab Asking for Page

 Done

Thanks Blob8108 for suggesting this to be moved out of Curiouscrab's talk. ;)

Anyway, I was recently reading through the Scratch Forums, and I stumbled across this topic: Just wondering...... (Is this in the right place?)

Basically, the topic is a collab asking for a page on the Wiki, though before I make their page, I'd like to stop here quickly. I remember reading a few discussions in the Community Portal about collab pages, and I don't remember much about them, but I really don't want to skip over anything important. So, is there anything I should keep in mind while I'm making the page?
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 20:48, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

I ought to read what's on my talk page more often. I didn't know about this conversation going on there. I think the messages banner might be broken.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 21:17, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

I think that might be true because I haven't gotten a single message either from the pages I'm following (I believe they should give a message) or from my talk page. I don't know... do you think this should be turned into it's own conversation? Oh, and I'm also getting a bug where the Search bar collapses in on itself a bit, so that could be included in the "bug report".
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 21:27, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

I'm not sure if we're going to continue to host pages about collaborations in the future, but since they're allowed right now, you could. Just make sure that they're neutral.
veggieman001 (talk | contribs) 17:53, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

So it looks like after all there really isn't anything "important" to keep in mind that I hadn't already thought of. Thanks for the reply; I'll be moving this off to the archives in a bit.
ErnieParke (talk | contribs) 18:17, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Interwiki-Links to protected Pages

a) Could an Admin set following Interwiki-Links to protected or "not-to-Interwiki-Link" pages?

 (Scratch Wiki talk:Community Portal is not protected, but can't be linked by the normal way)

b) Are there other protected pages that would be useful to be Interwiki-Linked? Thank you very much in advance!

en	de
Main Page	Hauptseite
Scratch Wiki:Current Events	Scratch-Wiki:Aktuelle Ereignisse
Scratch Wiki talk:Community Portal	Scratch-Wiki:Gemeinschafts-Portal

MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 11:49, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

It seems that talk pages can't be interwikied. I added both of them.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 12:33, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Thank you very much! Perhaps we later find a way to interwiki-link the Community Portal too.
MartinWollenweber (talk | contribs) 21:07, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Interwiki on User Page

When I tried Interwiki on my user page, the box with the link to the DACH-Wiki was below everything unlike any other pages. See here.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 13:38, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

How is that different? The list of language links is always at the bottom of the sidebar, below Toolbox. At least, in the Vector skin, which I prefer to use as it isn't as buggy.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 16:42, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

It's also like that in the Scratch skin.
Scimonster (talk | contribs) 17:24, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Strange. It was different before, but now it appears that it changed. I must have needed to clear my cache.
Curiouscrab (talk | contribs) 23:09, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

New SDS?

I've seen http://scratch.mit.edu/studios/222542/ and was wondering if the frontpage should be updated to say it's the latest SDS (if it is)? The studio is made by the user ScratchDesignStudio so I presume it is.
EH7meow (talk | contribs) 18:02, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

The news should be updated when they add the SDS row back.
Mathfreak231 (talk | contribs) 21:27, 15 July 2013 (UTC)